As cities evolve, aging buildings present both challenges and opportunities. This panel explores how facility managers, sustainability leaders and asset experts can drive urban regeneration through retrofits, predictive maintenance and smarter long-term planning.
What does it take to transform aging buildings into resilient, high-performing spaces?
Recorded at IFMA's World Workplace Asia-Pacific, this panel brings together Samuel Ma, Head of Account Management at JLL, Andrew Macpherson, Executive Director, Head of Asset Development at JLL, and Caitlin Shem, Head of Sustainability Consulting at JLL, to discuss the future of urban regeneration. They explore why retrofitting existing buildings is often more sustainable than rebuilding, how facility managers can play a larger strategic role in asset enhancement, and why predictive maintenance, AI and better operational data are changing how buildings are managed. The conversation also examines the growing importance of resilience, biodiversity and government policy in shaping the next generation of cities.
Timestamps:
Caitlin Shem: [00:00:00] I think three key components, are really decarbonization, which I think everyone's well aware of in this day and age, resilience, and biodiversity.
Host: Welcome to Connected FM, a podcast connecting you to the latest insights, tools, and resources to help you succeed in facility management. This podcast is brought to you by IFMA, the leading professional association for facility managers. If you are ready to grow your network and advance in your career, go to ifma.org to get started.
Have you ever wondered what it takes to transform aging buildings into resilient, high-performing spaces? Well, today, host Samuel Ma, the head of account management at JLL, sits down with his colleagues, Andrew McPherson, an executive director, and Caitlin Shen, head of sustainability consulting, to discuss the future of urban regeneration.
They explore why retrofitting existing buildings is often more sustainable than [00:01:00] rebuilding, how facility managers can play a larger strategic role in asset enhancement, and why predictive maintenance, AI, and better operational data are changing how buildings are managed. The conversation also examines the importance of resilience, biodiversity, and government policy in shaping the next generation of cities.
Now, let's get into it.
Samuel Ma: Today we have a team be here. Myself Samuel Ma heading the tech workplace management account business in Hong Kong, Korea, Taiwan. We also have a two colleague one from sustainability side our expert in sustainability.
And the other is A-Andrew. Andrew is very Familiar in the asset enhancement, and he is the expert in the asset enhancement as well. So may- maybe we kick off? Okay. Okay. Yeah. Maybe the first question I want to ask Andrew, and then Cannon, feel free to step in.
Sure. I think nowadays for metropolitan or for [00:02:00] city aged building and low maintain the building we all facing a issue. They have a major impact in the city in term of the social side, in term of the environmental side, safety, all those things. I think urban regeneration and urban renewal is becoming more attended by a public.
How should we do more holistic planning for those aged facilities? So, maybe Andrew, are you able to share a bit what do you think the key element or key criteria-
Andrew Macpherson: Yeah ...
Samuel Ma: when we're doing the urban regeneration we should consider?
Andrew Macpherson: Right. Well, that, that, that's obviously a huge question and a lot of components to the answer.
I think it will be useful to our viewers to give a little bit of context and perhaps a bit of background as to why urban generation is, is required. So I think if you, if you think of some extreme cases, Detroit, for example, which the whole city was built on car manufacturing. When that original need shifted, effectively the whole city became redundant and ha- has had to [00:03:00]reinvent itself.
Closer to home in Hong Kong, you've got East Kowloon area, which is, which was largely based on requirements for industrial light manufacturing when Hong Kong was a, was a manufacturing base before it moved to to the mainland. So those original requirements for the city kind of dictated the type of assets that were built.
Other good examples would be, would be CBD areas in some Asian, Asia Pac cities. So, for example, Manila KL. I- in KL, for example, the original CBD is built around what they call the Golden Triangle, and there, and there's a high density of office buildings, commercial retail malls, hotels, that type of thing.
And then over the years, there's been what you call out-of-town developments or second CBDs that have attracted the commercial tenants away from those original city centers, leaving them many of those buildings [00:04:00] underutilized and, you know, kind of decaying. So it's a, it's a problem. The under-investment, not great living conditions But it also poses a great opportunity to, I think, rebalance those kind of ar- areas of town that were, that were very kind of single-focused or a narrow type of usage, to rebalance those areas and, and retrofit or repurpose buildings to provide more in the way of senior housing, student accommodation, arts and culture.
So, so a much more balanced neighborhood and, at the same time, improve the sustainability of those areas. I mean, man- many of those old buildings were kind of concrete construction, would act as a kind of heat sink. Not very green. So that is another benefit of urban regeneration, is to green the area and reduce the impact of, of the [00:05:00] climate, climate change.
And also improve buildings in terms of energy consumption. So a, a lot of reasons why urban regeneration is a good thing and a, and a great opportunity to kind of repurpose those old parts of town.
Samuel Ma: Thank you, Andrew. Yeah. Andrew, you mentioned a bit the angle from environmental impact, and also you mentioned a bit in the social impact as well.
Kenny, what do you think in term of sustainability angle?
Caitlin Shem: Sure. Yeah, when it comes to sustainability, I think the retrofit piece and also the repurposing is very important where we can, especially in APAC. It should be about using what we have rather than building new in most situations bec-because we're often limited by space as well.
I think three key components, and they'll touch on the environmental and the social factors- Mm ... are really decarbonization, which I think everyone's well aware of in this day and age, resilience, and biodiversity. So I'll break those down a little bit further, but where we consider urban renewal, it really should be around that retrofit first.
That's gonna be the most [00:06:00] sustainable approach that we can take. We'll avoid unnecessary demolition, and we'll also look after the embodied carbon that exists within those buildings. Then really the goal becomes around lower carbon and better livability, so this is where the social factors come in as well.
Where we can make things more efficient and more resilient they'll be more pleasant to use moving forward and also the af-affordability and displacement will be taken away ideally as well.
Samuel Ma: Mm. Mm-hmm.
Caitlin Shem: And then I think a big piece that gets touched on in certain markets but not in others is really thinking in systems rather than in silos.
So when we look at this, how we can actually combine all of these different factors, so energy, water, waste, nature, and even those mobility interventions to make the assets work within these precincts that will be the urban revitalization centers. I think when we, when we look at places like Hong Kong and Singapore, we're sitting in Hong Kong today, but we can look at broader APAC as well.
Take a green roof or planting a native species, for example. People might just think that that's there for an aesthetic purpose, but really that can reduce heat, [00:07:00] it can support people's wellbeing, and it can also help manage even stormwater issues as well. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So looking at how those interconnected pieces come together I think is really crucial.
Decarbonization has been front and center. It's part of many pledges, and it continues to be. But I also touched on resilience and biodiversity. So resilience is a key part of this. We all know about climate risk. It came up this morning in the keynote as well. We're seeing floods, heat, storms, typhoons, especially here in Hong Kong as well.
They're affecting the performance of the asset. They're affecting us personally. And this will lead into business continuity issues as well. So as we look at decarbonizing, we also need to couple that with resilience and proactive responses on what we can do there. We're talking on the asset level, right, Andrew, today.
But I think another key piece is what will actually happen in terms of those district scale solutions and what can be brought in. Anything from permeable paving through to restored waterways- Mm-hmm ... and how we work that. And then finally, I think the piece that's [00:08:00] still at the frontier and hasn't been fully addressed yet is biodiversity.
And I do wanna plug this a bit today because we have built cities-
Samuel Ma: Mm ...
Caitlin Shem: where natural environments existed before. How do we bridge that, and how do we bring those together? Through native planting, habitat corridors, green roofs, even pollinator-friendly environments. It might not be... I know this is happening a lot in the EU, in the UK.
They have homes for bees in bigs build- big buildings now. Like, why can't we bring, bring life back to the city in that way? But I think there's a, there's a group called City with Nature, and they, they allow commitments to be created and baselines to be understood. And China and Singapore are actually doing a fair bit within these spaces and embedding biodiversity into upgrades rather than it being an afterthought.
So I think this is an area where we can look to move not just from low carbon cities for renewal-
Samuel Ma: Mm ...
Karen: but also resilience and biodiversity.
Samuel Ma: Yeah. Okay. Then again, and when you mentioned a bit of the biodiversity-
Caitlin Shem: Mm ...
Samuel Ma: actually recently I visit Bangkok to to, to one of the JLL managed properties called One Bangkok.
Mm. And then [00:09:00] I'm very impressive when they're talking about how they build up their green, greenery area. But the point is how they integrate it in the urban development, urban landscape as well. Mm-hmm. So, type of the plan, how to grow, how to maintain. That's quite impressive. I mean, that's talking about the integration.
Yeah. And
Andrew Macpherson: I think, I think it's a good reference because those kind of new developments, One Bangkok TRX in KL from an asset point of view, I guess you would say the Henderson in Hong Kong. They're, they're establishing much higher standards of sustainability performance, human experience, amenities, that type of thing.
So they're, they're setting a high benchmark.
Samuel Ma: Mm.
Andrew Macpherson: They're attracting The best tenants, the best occupiers visitors to those areas, which is resulting in what you might call grade B buildings losing occupancy and rental rates. Mm-hmm. So it's a, it's a natural catalyst for asset enhancement- Okay ... or repurposing those older buildings bec- because they're not commercially [00:10:00] viable anymore- Yeah.
Okay ... become less viable.
Host: Are you looking to stay ahead in facility management? Join us at IFMA's World Workplace Conference and Expo, 18th through 20th of November 2026 in Anaheim, California. Here you can connect with facility management professionals from around the world, explore the latest workplace technology and solutions, and gain practical insights you can apply right away.
From expert-led education sessions to powerful networking opportunities, World Workplace is where the future of FM comes together. Register today at worldworkplace.ifma.org.
Samuel Ma: Hey, thank you, Andrew. I think we're coming back to another question. Now we talk about the investor angle and more on the macro level, how to develop our landscape. But coming back I think the conference is about facility management, so, I really want to understand a bit.
You can imagine now we talk about asset retrofit or asset enhancement. Basically it's talking about [00:11:00] how do we rent existing building. Building manager and facility manager must be one of the stakeholders. They need to manage the properties. But the challenges we face is this is because there's a retrofit project, multiple stakeholder, multiple parties- Mm
coming to a single site to do the work. So the responsibility, accountability are being dilute. How to demarcate a role, who is responsible for what, and then there are many, many challenges we are facing. So, maybe Karen start with Karen. Are you able to share a bit, what do you think from FM in a asset retrofit building?
What are their roles? How to play that game.
Caitlin Shem: Ma- maybe we can start by talking using a buzzword, urban steward. FM teams are the ones who understand the continuity and the user experience, and they'll be there once the retrofits ... or while the retrofit's being undertaken, but also be there for the operational part afterwards as well.
So really having their input from the beginning and bringing them in as part of the clear mapping of how a retrofit's gonna take place [00:12:00] could really help with defining these roles and responsibilities. The other piece that I think is when it, when it comes to the sustainability standpoint, is how we can bring in opportunities for transparency and data points and understanding.
So FM having more in a role of how we're going to sub-meter, add dashboards, make things clear and allow them to help with moving things from a reactive model into that more predictive model- Mm ... moving forward. So then they can focus their attention on how to be more reliable and efficient rather than on day-to-day tasks that come up.
Andrew Macpherson: Mm.
Caitlin Shem: I, I could go into data and AI, but do you wanna talk a little bit?
Andrew Macpherson: Yeah, I think I'll, I'll touch on that from a, from an owner and investor perspective. Mm. So as, as we know, developers, owners, investors, they're, they look at the dollars. They're in business to make money. So, yeah, there's a couple of broad areas where real estate investors make money and where property managers and facility managers play a, a key part.
On the retrofit, Yeah, m- most investment funds have a value add element. [00:13:00] So, you could call it buy, fix, and sell. Basically, they're looking for underutilized, unloved buildings, but in great locations that they can buy at, at an attractive price. Mm-hmm. Spend some CapEx, upgrade them, and then stabilize that better income and, and eventually sell them for a profit.
But on with assets that they have under management, there's, there's a few phrases that I'm hearing more and more nowadays, which is property management plus Active asset management- Mm-hmm ... proactive asset management. It's, it's basically fund managers wanting to get more into the detail of how to get better performance out of that asset, and it's very data-driven.
So I think the, the onsite property manager and facility manager who's the custodian of all that data- Mm ... there'll be an opportunity and a- and actually a responsibility on them to kind of centralize that data better, help the investment manager make [00:14:00] informed decisions to the point of, of being quite predictive.
You know, avoiding breakdowns and issues that might affect the attractiveness of the asset. So yeah, I think, I think the, the facility manager and the property manager is, is gonna play an important role in making better use of the data that they get from the actual asset.
Samuel Ma: Yeah. Yeah. I, I think many thanks for bringing it up.
I think actually property management or facility management, we talk for that concept, predictive, proactive, many, I quite, I'm quite confident in saying that now with the big data, with the analytic, with the AI, that may help us to change that mindset. Yeah. It's, it's- And the software is changing that mindset
Andrew Macpherson: I've had three or four conversations like that this morning- Yeah ... with, with old colleagues who I used to work with, who, you know, we kind of said, "Oh, we've been talking about this predictive maintenance for 20 years." But the advent of AI- Yeah ... aI agents, the ability to crunch data almost [00:15:00]instantaneously I think you're right, has made predictive maintenance a true reality rather, rather than a, a vision, and a dream, and a hope.
Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, I think now is the, now is the age of predictive maintenance.
Samuel Ma: Yeah. I have a last question. Mm-hmm. But not very challenging. But when we're saying urban regeneration we talk about investor, we talk about owner, we also talk about society as well as facility manager. But what do you think government should do?
And can you share a bit from your global or regional perspective what sort of the policies different government have been in place, and what are they good, what should be improved in order that we can activate or motivate that urban regeneration? Can you share a bit? Sure. Maybe start with Andrew.
Andrew Macpherson: Yeah. Yeah, a few examples. I mean, when, when we get- Asked to advise on an urban regeneration scheme. The, the typical process is that we, that we would do a [00:16:00] situation analysis. We analyze the current situation, what are the type of assets, how old are they, how utilized are they- Mm ... how do they perform? And a big part of it is to what extent do they meet current needs?
So there'll obviously be some shortfalls- Mm ... because of the way the, that part of town or the city was developed in the first place. So there might be no senior living. There might be very few student accommodation buildings. There'll be, there'll be a lack of a certain type of asset type. Mm. So we, we would then draw up a kind of aspiration or a to-be allocation of assets across the city, and then wherever possible, we would map existing buildings to the future use.
Some of that might be satisfied by upgrading or repositioning. Others, there might need to be a redevelopment element to it. For, for buildings that can be cost-effectively upgraded, then the private [00:17:00] sector has got a natural opportunity for value add. So they would acquire those buildings, they would upgrade them to the new use because the study has already proven that there's a certain demand for that type of asset.
So there, so there's financial viability. But for other building uses-
Samuel Ma: Mm ...
Andrew Macpherson: the private sector are not able to make so much money from those. Mm. So that has to be supported some way-
Samuel Ma: Mm ...
Andrew Macpherson: by government policies, whether it's tax breaks, incentives fast-track the approvals to be able to convert, say, a commercial building to a residential building.
So I think the, the government has got a critical role to play in partnership- Mm. Mm ... with the private sector to enable the as is to become the to-be for urban regeneration. Oh.
Caitlin Shem: Yeah, f-from the policy standpoint more the sustainability angle, I think what we can see is there is [00:18:00] acceleration happening more at the corporate disclosure level, not quite as evenly at the asset level. And there are some leading markets for this as well. I think the benefit of this happening at the corporate disclosure level filters right down to facilities management because it requires operational data inputs- Mm
to make those disclosures relevant. But where we're starting to see the needle move in terms of at the asset level, which will help, is asset level certifications in Australia with neighbors and Singapore with Green Mark. It's mandated, but only for certain asset classes. Mm. So how do we turn the voluntary pathways for smaller and older assets into something that's also required?
And we also see from an energy performance standpoint Singapore's recently released the mandatory energy improvement regime where it's going to penalize the worst performing twenty-five percent of buildings, and this is a really powerful stick. We were talking a lot about this- Mm ... when it comes to moving the needle on urban renewal and change.
This is the first time we've seen something like this in APAC, and this is part of the broader building master plan for Singapore as well. Mm. Hong [00:19:00] Kong's also making changes in a very similar direction. It's tightening its audit rules around energy efficiency, which will come into play this year, which will see more asset classes and publicly available dataset undergo energy audits, which is a step in the right direction also.
Mm. We see this, I think, because of net zero carbon commitments. We're coming to that midway point. But I think we need to go beyond this. We can't just focus on carbon and energy. We need to look at the resilience and biodiversity pillars- Mm ... that I mentioned earlier as well. So the... Yeah, uneven, but it is accelerating, and we're starting to see some change.
Samuel Ma: Yeah.
Andrew Macpherson: Yeah. I'd, I'd add to that in terms of you know, the availability of that kind of data. So, you know, years ago when I used to do a lot of technical due diligence, Sustainability and ESG was a, was a kind of small part of a technical due diligence study. Now- nowadays, the ESG due diligence is a, is a, you know, is a huge piece in its own right.
So, investors are look, are looking into sustainability performance in a lot more detail in terms of what impact is it gonna have, both on the [00:20:00] short-term attractiveness to, of the building to occupiers who, who are choosing to move to better performing buildings, but also the long-term asset value. I think it was, it was December 2025 when
RICS updated their Red Book, which is the rules for valuations. And so now valuers are obliged to take into account climate risk and sustainability performance when they value buildings. So that is a you know, that's a, that's a, that's a key point, right? So there's a direct correlation between the value of an asset and its sustainability performance.
So clearly if you're buying an asset that's not great performance in terms of sust- sustainability, you're gonna heavily discount your offer price. So it's... That, that's... Those kind of things are really speeding up retrofitting and improvements.
Samuel Ma: Yeah. Many thanks, Andrew and Karin. I think as a concluding, I feel a [00:21:00] bit for urban regeneration or urban redo, indeed in the industry, there are quite a lot of the practices and activities happening.
We're trying to build up a platform to exchange the idea with each other. But at the other level, maybe we also need to look at from a policy level, from a government level, do they of also have a platform able to share different policies? And then they can, no matter good or bad or lesson learned, they are able to adopt in a different setting.
Yeah.
Andrew Macpherson: Well, with, with, with governments pledging net zero carbon targets of 2050 I think there needs to be an acceleration. The Economist wrote a paper last year about the speed at which buildings are being decarbonized, and it looks unlikely that any government is gonna be able to meet 2050 unless retrofitting and sustainability improvements accelerate over the next few years.
Samuel Ma: Okay. Yeah. Many thanks. You're welcome.
Caitlin Shem: Thank you.
Host: [00:22:00] Thanks for tuning into the Connected FM podcast. If you enjoyed today's episode, please take a moment to rate and review the show because it really helps us reach more listeners just like you. And don't forget to hit the subscribe button so you never miss an episode. See you next time.